Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome to the Human Factor. I'm Kimberly diamond and today we're talking about real challenges and real wins behind building strong teams. You're watching now Media Television.
Hello, everyone. Welcome to the Human Factor.
We're here today with Erica Butler. I'm very excited. We are going to be unpacking some of the aspects of the workplace that I think a lot of businesses are going to be very interested in learning more about how they can maneuver and manage through. So today, Erica Butler, CEO of Hire LLC. Erica brings Fortune 100 HR experience to small and mid sized businesses. She helps leaders reshape their teams and cultures for lasting success. She's also a certified disc coach and an intercultural intelligence trainer. That's a mouthful. Two powerful tools for building diverse high performing teams.
So today we're going to talk about something that sounds simple but I feel like it's often missing and that's the listening factor. I think people feel like they really need to talk more than they listen.
So, Erica, welcome to the Human Factor.
I'd like to start here with what happens when people do not feel like they're heard. I think the audience sees that the company is very focused on a mission, but they're not really listening.
So my first question is what happens to a company culture when employees don't feel heard or valued?
Sure.
[00:01:30] Speaker B: Well, some initial signs of that. Of course, you'll have likely higher turnover than you would if they were feeling heard. They likely do not trust leadership if they're not feeling heard. They don't feel like they have a voice. They don't feel like they have connection points. Likely there's more conflict amongst the team, more drama because they don't know what to do with that and they don't feel they can go to anyone about that. So those are just some signs that you'll see when they don't feel heard by their leadership team.
[00:01:56] Speaker A: Yes, I totally agree with you. But sometimes they tend to glaze over them or, you know, prioritize other things. So, so what's, what's some of the signals? That, that your culture isn't working. That there are some challenges and issues there.
Sure.
[00:02:13] Speaker B: So some signals are your employees are not talking to you, almost like they're avoiding you even if you ask them how are you? Like they just don't share much information. They don't feel like it's heard.
I think sometimes there's a fear of leadership if the leader is very task focused, results oriented, which they should be, but not connecting with the team, they're like, wow, I don't want to say the wrong thing. I don't want to do the wrong thing. This person could fire me. This person could not promote me. I think leaders many times misunderstimate the power they have. They're like, it's just me, I'm just a person. But they're the person their employees are talking about at the dinner table many times. So I think helping leaders understand the power they really do have and what a gift it is and how they can influence people, those are just some signs and why it's so important for leaders to recognize the role they have and how powerful it is.
[00:03:04] Speaker A: Exactly. They need to understand that they can easily instill a little bit of fear in their team. So it's not on purpose. Not on purpose, but unconsciously. Right. Well, how about sharing a story with us where you experience were just simple. Listening to the team changed the environment, the culture.
[00:03:26] Speaker B: Sure. I mean, there's so many. But the one that really comes to mind is a team that I took over supporting with a large organization and they were hurting.
I was newer in the HR role and for two years they actually had a hostile work environment. And I use, I'm very careful using those terms. They had real harassment happening. And sadly, it went on for a really long time. And I, I, I lingered. I could tell something was wrong. I would, could tell they were scared to tell me. So I said, hey, like they were like looking at each other. I was reading body cues. And then I just, I said, I'm here, come talk to me. I'm going to stay for 20 minutes, 30 minutes. And then several hung back and told me just shocking things that were happening that it was really hard for people to talk about and to admit. So literally that launched an investigation that launched people getting terminated because it was not okay what was happening. And all that I did was linger and listen and ask deeper, you know, So I think just that lingering and pausing and reading body language is a really powerful tool we have as humans that we can lean into.
[00:04:29] Speaker A: Yes. You know, you see that very often where people are afraid to again speak up, but you can see by their body language that they're either intimidated, concerned. And I think if you can see those cues, you can, like you said, peel back a little bit more, dig a little bit deeper and earn their trust, you know, so in doing so, then you're actually back to trying to rebuild. So, you know, how, how can a company start rebuilding systems and you know, actually gain that trust back from a, say, such a toxic situation that you're discussing, you know, how do you rebuild that?
[00:05:05] Speaker B: Well, from watching your show, I know you talk a lot about this and care a lot about this, so I'm just gonna add on, I guess. But I think creating anonymous, confidential ways for them to give feedback and to be heard is so important because many times because of that fear, no one's fault. It's just this leader. It just, it does exist. They are named. They don't want their name attached to it. So once you put that little box up for employees to share or you have a focus group with only HR that is, you know, promised to be confidential and it must be, and we share the feedback as a group. Right. They feel a lot more able to share honestly, openly and vulnerably without any retaliation or risk for their, for their career, if that makes sense. And I find that there's so much I could tell you, but that's like the number one thing. If you do that, you're going to, you'll, you'll hear a lot more from the team and.
[00:05:57] Speaker A: Yeah, and what about surveys? Like, how do you, what is your thought around surveys providing anonymous feedback? Right.
Even at the get afraid, they're like, my name's going to be on it. How are they going to know? I'm like, no.
[00:06:10] Speaker B: I hear a third party where it's like the leaders see nothing, no names. I've been part of groups where there was a policy. Anyone with five employees or less didn't get results, but they got group results so that they couldn't look at comments and pick and choose. So if they have five or more even policies like that in place help people feel like they can share truly, honestly, with no names attached. I'm a huge fan. I think every organization should do that.
[00:06:34] Speaker A: That's a great idea. I didn't think about it being a smaller group and person, potentially being able to identify the person's responses. Right. So that makes a lot of sense. So that's a very good point. And that's, that's good information.
So moving on to what's a small step a leader can take today to improve how they listen. Is there training that goes with that or is it just.
Do you just have some specific tips that you could share?
[00:07:04] Speaker B: This is such a small, simple step, but I've seen so many leaders not do it. And the leaders that do it build amazing relationships with their team, walk the floor. And if you don't walk the floor every day, walk it every week. For remote teams, that might be a huddle meeting and truly how are you?
And I think just making time in your schedule, even if you have to put it on the calendar to talk to each team member. How is Bobby's soccer game? Little things like that open the door for team to share, feel like there's a real connection, feel like they actually will get caught if they do share how they're feeling, if it's good, bad, whatever it is. So that's so simple and there's so much more I could say, but that simple step is going to open up conversation that you wouldn't have otherwise.
[00:07:44] Speaker A: And you know, I used to, and I'm sure you've seen this and done this as well when you know, I was in a leadership position like that, I would always want to get together in the morning and gain, gauge the pulse of the team. You know, obviously depends on the size of the team. Okay. But in my case, you know, I had seven recruiters. I wanted to just for a couple of minutes in the morning, do a little recap. And I think at that point I could kind of gauge where people were feeling that day. There was any, you know what I mean? If they were feeling a little stressed or they had something on their mind. And I thought that that just kind of opens it up to that, you know, open forum. Let's, let's get the day going. Let's start this off, you know, on a good foot and take on anything. So I think that that's, so you, you start your day listening instead of just jumping right into the have to dos type of thing. So yeah, wonderful.
[00:08:32] Speaker B: Absolutely.
[00:08:34] Speaker A: Anything you have to add, feel free. But that's, that's just something that I did as, as a, as a leader.
[00:08:39] Speaker B: The only piece I'll add, which is I think really powerful, life changing even, is doing a 360 degree feedback survey. Every leader should have that opportunity all around you to get that feedback and no names are on it. But you just learn so much and you write yourself as well and see where am I aligned on my strengths, where am I not? And it just is such valuable information you can use to keep growing as a leader.
[00:09:01] Speaker A: Yes, and you're right, it's not just about the feedback. It is about evaluating and looking at what you're doing, making any potential adjustments and, and you know, then maybe figuring out how to really address it very personally without giving it away. Right. Like, you know, I know I've obviously been missing the mark and I'm gonna do not so blatant. You know what I mean?
Well, this has been wonderful information this is, you know, I always enjoy speaking with you. We have a lot of things that we could deep dive into, but we have to take a quick break and then we'll be back with a continued conversation here with Erica Butler. So stay with us. And also we'll be right back with more stories, insights and real world strategies for leading with purpose.
This is the Human Factor on NOW Media Television.
And we're back. I'm Kimberly diamond and you're watching the Human Factor on NOW Media Television. Let's dive back into today's conversation.
Welcome back, everyone. We are here with Erica Butler having an enjoyable conversation. Erica is the CEO of Hire H I H R llc and she is a leader in helping businesses build truly inclusive teams. With her expertise in disc and intercultural intelligence, she brings practical strategies what often feels like the vague and overused corporate goal. This segment, we're going to dig into the disconnect between DEI promises and the live workplace experience.
You know, we often see this area in the company, they say they care about diversity and I believe a lot do, but it often feels like it's just a statement, not something that they're really doing much with. They're trying to brand themselves in such a way. But are they really taking the steps within the organization to actually facilitate, you know, the, the diversity? So in your opinion, Erica, after what you've seen, especially with your intercultural intelligence, why do so many of these efforts fall flat even with they really, they outline everything but they just kind of fizzle out?
[00:11:11] Speaker B: I've noticed a few things. One, I think it can quickly become a numbers game and it has. And you're just trying to stick people in different roles to get the right numbers, which is not meeting them where they're at as an individual and just going off of that. I think sometimes we can make sweeping assumptions based on what we think we know. And then, yeah, people can fail and not have the support they need and other people can miss out on great opportunities. I've just seen it blow up sometimes and then people almost because of that, shy away of something that's so critical for business success and so important. So those are a few things I've noticed over the years.
[00:11:48] Speaker A: Okay, yes, I've noticed it as well. I've worked for organizations and we've talked very, you know, in depth about that, the inclusivity and what that looks like. And you're right. And it's like we have great intentions. We set up these various engagement groups and then we try to get people encouraged to do that. And Then, you know, but it just seems to kind of sometimes lose its momentum. So I think it's something that you need to keep in focus.
You know, I think it's very important to have a diverse group, but I don't, you know, it should be based on skills and their abilities and how they interact with each other as a group too, you know, so I agree with that. Okay.
Why does inclusion look like not not just in policies, but in everyday interactions? What does inclusion really look like?
[00:12:38] Speaker B: I'll speak to it as a feeling because I think it's something you feel. You either feel included or you feel not included. So when you have a culture of inclusion, you can bring your whole self to work, you can put that picture of your family up, you can talk about your faith, whatever you want to talk about you. You're yourself at home as you are at work. And that's a beautiful thing. Where people thrive. Everyone has a seat at the table, everyone's in the in crowd. People are embraced for what makes them quirky or different, which we all have. And like, having space to do that is really a beautiful thing. So when it's working well, that's what it feels like and looks like.
[00:13:15] Speaker A: And, and I think that comes from the leaders as well. I think they need to encourage that. It really should not be just at the team level, you know, within each other. I think it's, you know, obviously everyone likes to. You're together all day, you know, in most cases now, you know, some of us, it's a little different environment. But when you are in an office, you spend most of your day with these individuals. So you certainly don't want to feel outside. You know, you want to feel included. And, you know, sometimes it takes effort and work because not everyone's an extrovert. You know, some people are introverts.
So it takes a little more effort to create that inclusivity for some of those people. You know what I've seen. So go that extra step. Okay, well, we also know about unconscious bias.
Can you explain how unconscious bias shows up in hiring and or promotions?
[00:14:03] Speaker B: Absolutely. So unconscious bias, it's just so real and it tricks us, it tricks our brain because of what we've known in the past. We put things in boxes, people in boxes. We don't even know we're doing it. So I think the sooner we can be aware that we're doing it and remove it as much as we possibly can in our processes, it helps. So one example, we, we have a leadership training we've done for a Long time. And we use a study and it's mind blowing because we're not talking about even gender and race, sexual orientation, all these things we talk about a lot. We're talking about sports. So there was a study done with thousands of individuals and they had the same name, same resume, but one resume would say the sports were golf and boating and skiing. The other resume was like soccer. And for a law firm like three times, the people that had the, I guess rich kids, I'm just going to, for better term sports, were given interviews and it was literally the same resume, same name, team, everything. And that is a bias, That's a real bias that maybe they're assuming, well, they had better educations or they had better this, better that, I don't know. But it just shows you how deep it really is, how ingrained it really is. And it's just something we really care about and teach about. So that's how it shows up. But people have better opportunities. When the bias of the leader says because of this, that means they're going to perform better because of this. And it's based on nothing. It's based on no fact, just assumptions. The more we can be aware of it and combat it, the better.
[00:15:28] Speaker A: Absolutely. And you're right, it's just innate. You know, it's just how we, how we were raised or how we, how we have worked through different environments and seen different things that can create that is kind of hard to loop yourself out of that and to get other individuals, you know, in, within that process to, to do the same thing because they just innately go to what they know. And it's unfortunate that they don't realize it's a bias. They think it's just, it's the way they think.
So that's a good call out on that one. Yeah, absolutely. Well, what are some of the practical ways to make the dei? Going back to that, to making the DEI part of a company's daily habits. Like what? You know, what particular steps or strategies or programs do you have in mind?
[00:16:17] Speaker B: Well, I find the best is truly training and awareness. But, you know, that's a, that's a given. But in addition to that, I think as many of our policies, processes, we don't lump people in. For example, parental leave. Why do women get more than men? Men might be the one that wants to care for the kid. I just think taking out any assumptions that you would have and make policies as neutral as possible, if that makes sense. That's just one example. And then also staying close to it to your point earlier, Kimberly, surveying, asking, do you feel included? Do you feel like we are, we celebrate diversity here, what can we do better? Like staying really close to that and what, how the team's feeling is a nice way to keep learning and growing as an organization?
[00:17:00] Speaker A: And do you also feel that it's important for them to display that they're, you know, that they're conscious about that, you know, in, in their daily activities. Right. Obviously, like you said, creating some of that, that material. But I want to say like from a social media perspective, right. They show them showing the diversity of their teens, acknowledging that and you know, they can see that is out there and it's believed and it's fact.
You think that that's something that they, they can as well incorporate?
[00:17:30] Speaker B: Yes, absolutely. As much as possible, role modeling it, living it, living it in groups, work groups. And it looks a lot of different ways to a lot of different people.
[00:17:38] Speaker A: Right.
[00:17:38] Speaker B: There's a lot of ways to do it.
[00:17:39] Speaker A: Right.
[00:17:40] Speaker B: I think, but I, I totally agree with you.
[00:17:43] Speaker A: Okay, so for companies who are just starting out, what's one powerful action they can take with respect to some of the things we just covered that will have a long term effect and matter to the organization and to the individuals?
[00:17:58] Speaker B: So of course we talked about training and awareness if an organization hasn't done that yet, because some people don't know about unconscious bias. I didn't know about it until I was trained about it. So I think as much as you can make people aware and educate them, things will get better. And then also to your point earlier, celebrating differences and welcoming them and inviting them, I think we can do that and just makes everyone feel more included and like they can bring their differences to work and be themselves.
[00:18:28] Speaker A: Well, we've, we've got more time, so I'd like to kind of deep dive a little bit more. Is there anything in particular, any stories that you can share with us with some of your clients? You don't need name names where you're. These activities were implemented and you saw some results from that?
[00:18:46] Speaker B: Yes. Going a bit deeper, we didn't talk about this, but in the cultural intelligence space, which is understanding the world views of different values and there's three that have been identified, but it's called a third culture space and it's understanding that, I'll give a real example, working with a group that their leader was from Asia, but most of the group had Western values. So Western speaking, Western Europe, U.S. you know that that's kind of the group they're from. But Some people were speaking very against the leader and they meant it as a challenge in a good way. It wasn't to, to put her down, but she took it that they were being disrespectful and shaming her, dishonoring her, and it was really hurtful for her. Also. She had people who were very motivated going above her to bosses, suggesting ideas and projects. And she took great offense to that. In the west, we're like, wow, you have ambition, Go get it done. But she was like, you really shamed me and dishonored me and took it very personally. It really was a struggle for that. Those relationships, had they been trained or known that they could have, we can easily tweak how we communicate. We could have taken her aside and given the feedback not in front of the group. So these are things like this. We just educating and knowing the values will make much more effective projects globally and better communication all around where people feel valued and lifted up, if that makes sense.
[00:20:10] Speaker A: No, absolutely. I never really thought about it that way because you're right. Based on their cultural background, communication can be very different.
And you know, so, you know, and as you said, if you have a training program to train people on, you know, it's almost kind of like think before you speak, you know, assess your audience.
[00:20:30] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:20:30] Speaker A: And, and see if it will be received as you meet as you intend it to be received.
Right. So I think that that's great advice for people to do. I, I, I just, I just really appreciate that because it just kind of dawned on me with, with that type of training. I, I never had been exposed to someone who offered that type of training.
Yeah.
[00:20:50] Speaker B: So you think I'm being ambitious and oh, I'm gonna get points and then your, your leader's upset with you. So it's like huge, Right?
[00:20:58] Speaker A: Exactly, exactly. But it's so funny because I just never had that type of training offered.
So what you do, that's, that's wonderful. People really should take advantage of that information and get in touch with you. So.
Well, I mean this again, another incredibly eye opening even for myself, as you can see.
So for organizations looking to make or make this type of change, to institute some of these programs and processes and learn more about how to do that, where can they find you in your organization?
Sure.
[00:21:32] Speaker B: The best place is go hire website go h I h r.com and we have a comment box. We'll get back quickly as well as our LinkedIn page, H IHR LLC. And we're active there and we'll be happy to Follow up with anyone who is interested in training or resources here to elevate their team in global cultural awareness and how we can work better together.
[00:21:55] Speaker A: I think that's important people realize that you are global so that really, you know that I know this audience is broad. So that's wonderful.
Well, the NOW Media app can be found on Roku tv, everyone. So if you're looking how to find these segments and be able to listen to them again, that's where you can find them. Stay with us. We are going to talk with Erica again here in just a little bit. So we'll be right back after this break. Thank you.
We'll be right back with more stories, insights and real world strategies for leading with purpose.
This is the Human Factor on NOW Media Television.
And we're back. I'm Kimberly diamond and you're watching the Human Factor on NOW Media Television. Let's dive back into today's conversation.
Hello. We're back with Erica Butler, the powerhouse of behind Hire H I H R llc. We've talked about culture and inclusion and now we're going to start to go straight to the source.
So hr, the big HR word, Right.
So if people think that HR is just about forms and rules and this conversation is definitely going to change their mind.
You know, Erica, I'm familiar with HR and working with HR business partners and I believe that there's probably many people in this audience that just think that HR is here to push the rules. Right. But it often feels like no one realizes how powerful HR can be when it comes to the culture, you know, just shaping the whole organization. They're very, very important with that. And I think people lose sight of it and often think that it's again, just, I'm just here to crack the whip and tell you what you're doing wrong.
So why is it a mistake for businesses to treat HR as an administrative department?
You know, in today's world, sure.
[00:23:51] Speaker B: So it is so common that they make assumptions as the party planners or the terminators. I mean we just, we, it's so funny we fall into this like box on the side that what we do everything and nothing. I mean that's like jokes about human resources. And I think, Kimberly, it's a, it's a huge miss because human resources can partner with you on strategy of talent development, succession planning, career development, process improvement where there's inefficiencies throughout your whole organization. You tell me a problem in the organization, I will tell you how a strong HR partner can work with you to solve that problem. It's a very collaborative function and it's not just for compliance. That's important, but that's a very small piece of the puzzle.
[00:24:35] Speaker A: Yes, it is. And yes, it's been a stigma. And I know that some businesses feel like it's a hindrance. You know, they, they hinder the process and they're trying to do things, but they don't really understand that they really save the, the, the department or the team or the organization. They really, you know, they're there to make sure that the risks are minimal and that, that, you know, they can continue to do what they do in their, in their department.
So how can HR leaders become culture builders rather than those compliance enforcers that we kind of mentioned?
[00:25:09] Speaker B: Well, to be fair, I'll answer this, but going off of your last comment, you know, I think leaders need to hire for HR people that get that it's not compliance because there are HR people out there that are truly focused on compliance and they're like a police officer. But then there's a lot of HR people that get they can be a strategic partner and really support the business and elevate the business. So, you know, to answer that question, the HR partners who want to be that strategic person, they can delegate compliance as much as possible. If there is already a payroll function outsourced like paycorp adp, a lot of times they also will send the updated state compliance posters check. You know, there's a lot of ways you can automate compliance to still make sure your business is covered and risk free, which frees you up to dive into the talent planning, the recruiting, the top talent and their process building. That's going to promote a great, healthy culture where people thrive, thrive and make clients happy, customers happy. You can really lead with that. But the compliance piece, you can automate a lot of it today.
[00:26:16] Speaker A: Absolutely, absolutely. And I just think it's very important for them to have that opportunity and not be bogged down. I don't think that. I think you're right. There are some HR individuals that their experience and their career path has been in environments where people treated them more like compliance officer and really haven't allowed them to have the voice outside of that. And I think that that's a big miss for an organization. You know, especially if you have a very talented HR business partner, there are a lot of strategies that you can align together and to really, you know, strengthen the culture. And I think that's, you know, I've seen that as a big miss, you know, even in talent. I think Talent acquisition is another one of those where you're just a recruiter. Well, no, you know, we, we get to know the organization, we get to know the people, we know, you know, how they, what their jobs are. So you voice too, you know, there's, there. We get put into the bucket as well. So I, I absolutely think that they don't realize the strategy around working together so.
Well then for you, what's an example where a strategic HR person helped a company succeed or scale?
[00:27:24] Speaker B: I will talk about an example I live through. So when I took over a role with a large organization as their like HR head, you know, they, they didn't have an HR strategy. They were somewhat newly acquired and they just didn't have a strategy. They didn't have that partnership previously. And what I did was a few things. So one, if you're working as an HR in a big company, you should always make sure every group you're supporting is connected to the larger organization as much as possible because that's not always the case. So I educated that, you know, your tuition reimbursement. Do you know you have an LMS learning management system that you can grow?
Do you know you have employment resource, employee resource groups? They didn't, you know, and I think being aware of what the larger organization offers and make sure that communication is down to every part of the organization so they feel that value as an employee. That's one, two is you're going to like this. Kimberly. I think they had roles open for nine months. So I just put this. One of the top four rungs of my HR strategy that I was reporting out to the leadership team was recruiting and it was sales roles and like we're missing out and they knew it. But that can't be. We're missing out on so much revenue. Right? Open territory for nine months. Absolutely not. So that was like a huge focus to work with our recruiters and like bring everyone together and like problem solve and. And we figured out why it was taking so long and we turned that around. So like key things like that, that really, that bring in revenue, that elevate the business. That's why I said HR truly touches every par and you can even losing first years and they don't know why. So we put a whole program around onboarding first years. For the first 12 months they were just covered and mentored and they were loving it. I mean it just completely turned around our turnover for first years. So there's just so much you can do as an HR partner to elevate every Part of the business.
[00:29:11] Speaker A: I love that. I absolutely love what you just said about that. 1212 months. It really.
Retention's a challenge anymore. Obviously people have a lot of options and if they, you know, you can lose people, they start to feel disengaged, you know, not appreciated what, you know, just. Or not getting what they need. You know, sometimes you get, they put them into a position and you know, they go for, you know, they, I, I definitely believe in the 90 days a year would, if you could get an organization to commit to that process.
[00:29:40] Speaker B: Quarterly check ins.
[00:29:41] Speaker A: Just quarterly check ins. Yeah, like I believe in definitely that 60, 30, 60, 90 program, you know, for sure. If you really want to, you know, to help your retention first year.
So, you know, you're speaking my language there. That's a big thing for me. So. Well then how can small companies use HR to compete with the bigger companies that have the big, you know, the whole HR scale? You know, they have one HR person that has to do everything. Payroll, benefits and recruiting and employee relations.
[00:30:15] Speaker B: Love it. I love this question. I will use this opportunity to give a life hack for leaders in this position.
So I mean I have seen thousands and thousands of surveys now results I just, you know, thousand and it's the same every time. The top three, and I'll add a bonus, the top three reasons people are frustrated, dissatisfied. It's communication, it's lack of recognition, it's lack of accountability and it is career development. The last one, it's a little smaller. But that's another reason people rate poorly on surveys. It doesn't matter. Fortune 100 small companies, it's just a theme that people struggle with. And it's also hard for the company. So knowing that information as a leadership team with only one HR professional or a part time HR person, tackle that, run at that, build great communication routines for your team, build recognition plan for your team. Like if you can take care of those four things, it doesn't matter who you're competing with. If you do that well, you will have a strong performing team with low turnover. If you can do those four things well and rally around those four things.
[00:31:15] Speaker A: Right and they can build those out in advance and have that process ready. You know, just. It's a step process that they take and it will really make a big difference. And then they can also work with individuals like yourself to help them. You know, it's, there's nothing wrong with reaching out to a resource. You know, I know budgeting, budgets are very important to people, but resources can get them launched and started it doesn't mean it has to be a forever, you know, forever relationship. It's nice if it is, but you know what I'm saying, at least get them going in that direction so they don't feel so overwhelmed by trying to.
Because I, I do deal with a lot of groups that, that's what happens. They're small and because they're small, obviously they're using my services because they don't have a recruiting team potentially. They have like one HR person who's doing everything and you know, you can see where they, number one gets struggle and they get burnt out because they're trying to balance everything. But if they have that program set in place and they know what that process is, either set by a professional like your team, or they build it themselves. They can just, they just know that's what they follow, that piece is done. They just have to stay consistent with it. So yeah, I agree.
[00:32:21] Speaker B: So someone's willing, your expertise is, you know what you're doing, Kimberly, and you're gonna add value quickly. It's not like, oh, this person in operations, let's put them in recruiting. I, they could get trained. But like hiring someone for a project that knows what they're doing is going to really pay off. I believe that. I've seen it just.
[00:32:39] Speaker A: I believe it too. I believe it too. Yeah, absolutely. Well, if someone's building an HR team from scratch, what should they prioritize first?
[00:32:47] Speaker B: Yes, I would say absolutely. Number one is the pulse survey. The, and what I mean by that is where does the team stand? What's going well for them, what isn't, what are the low hanging fruits we can just easily knock out right away because if there are issues with the team and they're frustrated, we want to address that as a, as possible. Number two, of course is compliance. Right. You don't want to be out of compliance with employment law. So just we have assessment to see. Red, green, yellow, where do you fall? What do we need to knock out? And the last piece is what are the broken processes that are just causing inefficiency, causing frustration across the team that we can use continuous improvement and fix. So those are like the three areas I would run at first. If you are new to a team or need HR support on your team.
[00:33:31] Speaker A: Okay, and then, then what? How about the recruiting side of it? Do you, you know, is that. Because a lot of times that's where they are. They're, they're sitting on two. When I'm come across them, it's, I need recruiting help. But I need people to keep me compliant. So it's like these are like what their focus is right now. Right. So obviously, you know, so they're trying to, to balance that. And I've recently worked with a couple companies like that. So I think they, they, if they need recruiting they, they need to understand what their, where their resources can be, where they can get them, whether it's a temporary environment, staffing, what have you. Just to have that in their back pocket, in their bucket. Have it, have that to reach out to while they're getting their arms around any compliance issues.
[00:34:12] Speaker B: If they have open key positions, fill them as soon as possible.
[00:34:15] Speaker A: Exactly. Because it stresses them out. They're just like, they're all over the place.
[00:34:20] Speaker B: So everyone's doing multiple roles every, I mean it's just not worth it. I would like really rally around that. But at the same time, compliance, you can, you can do an assessment, three to five hours and know where you stand. So it's really actually not this overwhelming thing. It's a low cost and at least you know where you stand. Take some of the stress out and you're like, all right, that's what it is. This is what we have to fix. So I feel like for even small companies, budget wise, it's affordable and like get those position filled asap.
[00:34:45] Speaker A: Absolutely. I totally agree. Yes. And it sounds like you have the ability to help them with that because a lot of them don't. They, they're not sure, they're not really if they, some of them don't even have HR and they've never had it so they don't really know where they're out of compliance. So that someone like you or a consultant can, can, you know, help them identify that and get on top of it before it gets out of hand while they're trying to build positions.
Okay, well Erica, where can they find you and your company?
Sure.
[00:35:15] Speaker B: The best place is our website at gohire go h I h r.com and we have a comment box. Love to get back to you for any of these topics and further discuss.
Also we're on LinkedIn HiHR LLC and you can comment on our page. Reach out to us and we'd love to be in touch.
[00:35:33] Speaker A: Great. We're going to take a quick break. We're going to come back with another conversation with Erica. So stay with us.
We'll be right back with more stories, insights and real world strategies for leading with purpose.
This is the human factor on NOW Media Table Television. And we're back. I'm Kimberly Diamond. And you're watching the Human Factor on NOW Media Television. Let's dive back into today's conversation.
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So as we wrap up, we're bringing Erica Butler back for one of the most important segments of this conversation.
I'm really excited about it.
So we want to know what it takes to rebuild trust in a broken workplace. Okay. I know you and I have probably stepped into these environments and it can be a challenge.
So if your company has been through a rough patch, a toxic leader or just years of silence, this is the conversation that you don't want to miss with us. You know, Erica, I feel like the people in the audience who have experienced this type of situation, people have maybe had a leader that made them feel unsafe or ignored. And I know trying to rebuild trust after a situation like this can be like rolling a rock up a hill.
I've seen it before.
So we would love to get your insight on this topic and you know, giving us some tidbits on, you know, how we can manage through this.
So why is trust so hard to rebuild once it's been broken at work?
Sure.
[00:37:45] Speaker B: If the same leaders in place, I think just trust takes time. And when trust is broken, confidentiality, you name just take it hurts, it hurts someone and then it just they don't trust that person anymore. They're not a go to person whatever it is. So I think character is one of the best things we can like have a good character and be trustworthy and don't let that go like cling to that over when people are watching, when people are not because it is really hard to earn back. Possible but very difficult.
[00:38:15] Speaker A: Difficult.
Yes, yes. We've seen it before and sometimes you just other leaders and individuals might need to step in for that reassurance until it can be rebuilt. You know, maybe find the ones that people still feel very confident and trust trusting in and have them step in.
So what are some of the signals that a team doesn't trust Its leadership.
Sure.
[00:38:38] Speaker B: Some signals that will definitely cue you into this is resignations with no warning or no shock.
Had no idea they were unhappy, no idea they wanted to leave. That's like a red flag. Hey, exit interviews lean into that.
Exactly. Avoiding not confiding in leaders. Like leaders don't really know where their team stands. If someone asks them, they couldn't even speak to it because the team's not talking to them. And I also think an increase of conflict and drama among the team because they don't feel like they can go to the leader. So these are all signs that might want to listen in a little closer, might want to lean in a bit to your team. There might be trusted people issues.
[00:39:14] Speaker A: Yes, I agree, I agree. Some people, again, they feel blindsided and then sometimes you just wonder why.
And exit interviews I think are very important and I think that they're often more feared than instituted. I think they're afraid for the feedback and how that might reflect. So, you know, it's interesting. But, but, but to your point, you know, actually it should be confidential with hr, but it does help the organization understand better if there's, if there's a challenge they need to address. So people should exercise those as often as they can.
Okay, well, can you share how a company you've worked with began to earn back the employee trust? Did they do some specific steps, programs? What was their process?
[00:40:00] Speaker B: Sure. Actually, I'll just give one specific example.
The leader did make some missteps and they actually started with a policy apology that addressed the whole team.
And then following that, we put in place more two way feedback because it wasn't there. So we, we did put in place more focus groups, more ways to hear from the team.
We had that leader walk the floor more often and just be available and have office hours that they never had more approachable to the team. And it did take time, but that, that person did show humility. And I think when a leader says, says hey, I'm not perfect, I messed up and shows humility and then they actually show up and put the actions in place and do them, it can be redeemed. It can be redeemed. But now on the other side, if the leader won't show humility, if they won't say I'm sorry, if they are not willing to do those things, it likely is a situation that's going to have to be an exit at some point.
[00:40:56] Speaker A: Exactly. They, they should be able to see where they have misstepped and own it. I think that that helps everyone understand that they're human and they get it, you know, so well, what's the difference between showing that, you know, we care? What's the difference between saying that they care and then actually showing it?
[00:41:16] Speaker B: I think it's really easy to see if a leader cares or not about their team, like genuinely cares, because you can say at a meeting, yep, we care about you all. You're so important. Thanks for driving the business. But then that's it. Or you can actually, you know, show up for your one on ones and not cancel them. You can be present on the floor, you can, hey, customer service call. How did it go? I mean, you really are more present leader. And I think even people with big organizations can be present leaders that care about people and know people's names, for goodness sake, and work to know people's names. I mean, that's powerful for people to feel known and connected to a leader, no matter how big the team is, of course, hundreds of people, it's not always possible. But just being present, showing up, listening, showing kindness, that goes a long way. That goes a long way for people.
[00:42:00] Speaker A: It does. And I had an experience with a Fortune 500 company where the CEO, when he was at the corporate location, he would walk around and make it a point to say hi to everyone, hold town halls. I think that those are really important for people to be able to see the process and the transparency of the organization. What's happening, the positives, you know, not just the, you know, where, you know, what are we missing? What do we still need to do? Do? I think those things can be expressed, but they can be done in a tone that's more positive. So I think you're right that, that, that senior, senior tier leadership really needs to, I believe, focus on their presence. You know, even though it may be once a year, it's still, you know, when you never see them, you're like, are they, are they, do they really.
[00:42:47] Speaker B: Exist and do they care?
[00:42:49] Speaker A: Can I, do they care?
[00:42:51] Speaker B: I'm so glad you gave that example because it reminded me it was younger in my career, but it was literally a Fortune president, this incredible woman, and I was the HR person. I was nervous, right? I'm like, oh my gosh, we're hosting her. What is she going to talk about and do? She spent her whole day sitting with the customer service team and then meeting with the operations team and she just sat there and was on calls. I'm like, what? How does she have time for this? And I was blown away. And since then, I mean, it just, I not Every leader will do that. Many come and don't even say hi to people. And here she is spending her day. She's like, no, this is my job. I need to know what are our customers saying? What is the experience for the team? I. It just impacted me in such a. And everyone felt that way. Even if you didn't get a time with everybody. They saw her sitting there with the team and she was like, I'm one of you. I'm for you. It is that they watched that behavior. It was. Yeah, I'll never forget it.
[00:43:45] Speaker A: No, they do it. It goes a long way. Even if it's a small segment of their. Of their, you know, their process, when they come to visit or in the course of the year, people remember. Because I have been with organizations where I've never seen it. I've been. Well, actually, I worked with another Fortune 500. The CEO was just literally next to the recruiting team. And every morning he'd come by and talk to us and say, how's it going? You know, guys need anything? I mean, you know, he was always very present. So I do remember that as well. And I appreciated it very much. And he knew my name. You know, it was. It was. You know, obviously, because he walked past us every day, it was a little easier than knowing everyone's name. But, you know, it was. Was very heartwarming to me. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed the conversations with him too. Well, what can a leader do to start changing the story in a damaged culture?
[00:44:36] Speaker B: Sure. So if they're taking over a damaged culture, say they're inheriting it. There's a best practice that I absolutely love. It's called a new leader assimilation. And large companies do it. We do it for small companies. And it's. It's actually like three hours. Three to four hours in the room. You fly people in, even all together, and you talk about your pet peeves. The team's pet peeves. What's your favorite ice cream? Goodness sake. You know, like, get a little personal and you just really get to know each other. And I've seen teams that do this and then teams that don't. The teams that do this, they are vulnerable. The leader shows vulnerability. They build trust right from the beginning, and they just fly. They just move so much faster. Because they built that relationship early on. We say the first three months at least, if you can do this versus not. So that's just one best practice tip that I've seen be really effective. And then keep listening, learning, asking questions. Listen more than you talk like you said earlier, I think the more we can listen as leaders, the more effective we'll be because we know how our team's feeling and we can make better decisions. We have more information to make better decisions with for the organization.
[00:45:43] Speaker A: Right. If they know you're listening then they will talk and then you can learn more. Absolutely.
Well, thank you again, Erica. I always enjoy our conversations. We could go on and on.
This is a very valuable segment in my opinion. I think people really hopefully listened for leaders ready to earn back trust the right way and work through how to do that and get some coaching on that. Where can they reach you and in your organization for that?
Sure.
[00:46:10] Speaker B: I'd love to have you on our website. It's gohire.com G O H I H R and we have a comment box that we get back to quickly as well as our LinkedIn page. HiHR on LinkedIn and happy to interact, comment, answer questions. Feel free to reach out on there.
[00:46:28] Speaker A: Wonderful. Well, thank you again for spending time with us and offering such grounded, actionable advice.
From building feedback systems to making DEI meaningful and from seeing HR as a culture catalyst, not the compliance police, to leading through trust, you've shown us what what it means to humanize leadership and that's what we're about here. So to our audience, if you're leading a team, managing a department or even trying to build a culture that's been hurt, know this small actions consistency can build rebuild the trust, it can drive engagement and it can create a lasting change. And I think that's it's very important to look at the consistency side of it. I'm Kimberly diamond and this is the human factor where leadership meets humanity.
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Until next time. Thanks so much.
